My rc project

[reactor1967]

Here is a little unit I am in the designing phase right now that I am hoping to build. I have to figure out how to do the servo's with the weight system. Everything else I pretty much got a hand on. I plan to go with balsa wood at first then metal later on for the body.

My parts I am looking at.

http://www.rcdude.com/servlet/the-953/Himax-Brushless-Ducted-Fan/Detail

Himax RTR Brushless Ducted Fan - 50mm
Ready-to-Run high power dynamically balanced ducted fan with factory installed Himax HB2410-4100 brushless motor.
The MPI 50mm ducted fan unit represents a simple method of getting started in electric ducted fan model flying. It’s high performance makes it an ideal choice for use in medium to fast model jets. The removable intake ring enables the ducted fan to be installed inside the model or mounted externally. The rotor is dynamically balanced at the factory, which means that you can install and use it immediately; the difficult task of balancing the rotor is not required.

http://www.rcdude.com/servlet/the-748/Hyperion-Motor-Mount-for/Detail
Motor Mount for this motor.
Hyperion Motor Mount for 50mm Series
SKU: HP-Z50-FRMNT
Motor Mount for Hyperion Z50 Series and other 50mm brushless motors. Hyperion
$25.95

http://www.rcdude.com/servlet/the-1060/Scorpion-Brushless-ESC-V2/Detail

Scorpion Commander V2 15 amp ESC
Scorpion Commander Series Brushless Speed Controllers represent one of the best values in the speed controller market today. From the beautiful gold anodized heatsinks, to the unique metal containers that the ESC's are shipped in, everything about Scorpion Speed Controllers shows the company's commitment to quality. These ESC's are manufactured from top quality components, in a state of the art manufacturing facility, and are designed to provide years of trouble free operation.

The V2 models of Scorpion Sommander Speed Controllers contain new Helicopter programming that includes Soft-Start and Governor modes. The Soft-Start features 3 different user selectable spool-up times of 10, 15 and 20 seconds. The Governor mode allows for settings of 50, 60, 70, 80, or 90 percent throttle. Another update is a revised LVC feature that is no longer cell dependent. With the new LVC system, any value can be selected from 5.0 to 13.8 volts in 0.2 volt increments.

Also included with the V2 model ESC's is the exclusive Scorpion Wireless Programming System. This system includes a postage stamp size Infrared receiver module and a credit card size wireless remote transmitter. With this programming system, you do not need to unplug any wires or need to drag out a computer or cable to change the settings on your speed controller. The Scorpion Wireless Programming System makes changing your ESC parameters as easy as changing the channel on your TV. The adjustable parameters on every Scorpion ESC include: Battery Type, Cell Count, Low Voltage Cut-off Level, Power Cut-off Type, Current Overload Protection, Braking Level, Acceleration Time Delay, Helicopter or Airplane Mode, Soft Start Mode, Soft Start Duration, Governor Mode, PWM Frequency Selection, Timing Advance and Motor Rotation.
Scorpion Speed Controllers also include all of the ESC parameters clearly labeled on the heatsink assembly. Voltage range, current rating, BEC rating, Ni-XX and Li-Po cell count and input polarity are all clearly marked to avoid any confusion. Scorpion Commander Series Speed Controllers are also backed by a 2 year manufacturers warranty against defects in materials and workmanship, so you can buy with confidence. For a total package of Quality, Performance and Value, use Scorpion Brushless Speed Controllers.

Specifications

Weight (Without Connectors) ................. 17.7 gm (0.62 oz)
Max Continuous Current ..................................... 15 Amps
Operating Voltage Range ............................... 6 to 15 Volts
Max BEC Output ...................................... 2 Amps @ 5.0 V
On Resistance .............................................. 7.11 mOhms
Size ....................... 43 x 26 x 9 mm (1.67 x 1.04 x 0.37 in)

Scorpion Brushless ESC V2 15A
SKU: S-Com-15A-V2-ESC
$37.95


Rechargeable Helicopter Battery:

http://www.rcdude.com/servlet/the-Batteries-cln-Lipos--dsh--Hyperion-G3/Categories

Hyperion G3 VX 7.4V 2S 1100mah 35C/65C Lipo
Hyperion Generation 3 Lithium Polymer Packs are proving truly revolutionary in both performance and value. Compared to an average of the batteries on market last year, they provide up to up to 4x more cycles under the same discharge conditions. And that makes them a bargain price-wise.
But they also deliver the highest voltage and flattest discharge curves under load that we have ever seen, which makes them the best performer you can buy. And tests have shown that at the 70%-discharged point in flight, they are delivering as much as 40% more power than previous generation LiPo.
The fact that they can be safely charged at up to 5C rates - for charge times as low as 10 to 12 minutes - is just icing on a very tasty cake.
The G3 packs are made with a new Hybrid RS construction technology, super-fine substrate materials, rigorous ISO 9001 Quality Control, and final cell matching process, which all guarantee you not only this superb performance, but also tightly balanced and long-lasting packs.
The G3 "VX" 35C series is the battery for applications that need the highest possible voltage maintained at high discharge rates; for example highly aerobatic 3D airplanes and helicopters, competition gliders, pylon racers, and some EDF jets.


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wireless Camera

Color short range day cam:

http://www.dynaspy.com/product_info.php/cPath/21/products_id/134

Wireless 2.4GHz Mini Spy Camera
Powered By A 9-Volt Battery
displays to laptop via receiver with usb adapter. $138.99

BW long range night cam:

Will have to make power supply to fit a battery.

http://www.dynaspy.com/product_info.php/cPath/29/products_id/155

Our long-range wireless weatherproof low-light set is the best deal around! Cameras can transmit up to 800 feet to the receiver and even through walls thanks to their high-power transmitters. They can see in near-total darkness up to 45 feet from the target area.

RC Radio
----------------------

Receiver:

http://www.rctoys.com/rc-toys-and-parts/CC-BERG7P/RC-PARTS-RADIO-RECEIVERS.html

Berg 7P (RX-7CH VP) Vertical Pin 7 Ch 72MHz Programmable Micro Receiver SKU: CC-BERG7P $50.99

Add a 72MHz Berg Micro Receiver Crystal: $7.99 need at least 7 of them 1 for each motor 1 for simple robotics.

Add Castle Creations Link USB Programming Kit for CC BEC, Phoenix ESCs and Berg 7P Rx: $24.95 USD

Add Azarr M-72 Lite 72MHz Receiver Antenna: 7in, 0.375g: $12.95 USD

Add 26 AWG Three Strand Servo Wire 3 Feet Futaba Colors (no ends): $6.95 USD

Add A Thunder Power Receiver Pack Li Poly Battery
2 Cell Li Poly 900mAh: $29.99 USD (Consider a bigger one.)

Transmitter:

http://www.rctoys.com/rc-toys-and-parts/BR-MM-TX/RC-PARTS-RADIO-TRANSMITTERS.html

Replacement Micro Mosquito RC Helicopter Transmitter SKU: BR-MM-TX $8.95

Add 9V transmitter battery: $3.95 USD

 

[Einstein]

reactor1967

How will you counter the rotational torque generated by the thrust from the ducted fan motor?

 

[ruthless]

Here is a little unit I am in the designing phase right now that I am hoping to build. I have to figure out how to do the servo's with the weight system.

make two sets of servos on the same rod. lube half the shaft and then put a free hanging weight on it. do it on the other side, now you should have sorta something like a gyro.

now, put actual rc servo motors on the same rod. make sure they are glued on with epoxy. now put free hanging weights on the servo. the free hanging weights in your diagram look perfect.

you could also think of mini thusters. maybe a couple of 120mm fans in a duct on each side. that one would be tougher to work out though.

 

[reactor1967]

How will you counter the rotational torque generated by the thrust from the ducted fan motor?

Well I did not think of that. It would of been spinning. I can use counter rotational rotators instead. That would cancel the torque. Here is the parts for that.

http://www.maxxprod.com/mpi/mpi-266.html

I wonder if I can use this as a ducted fan too? Also, I will have to get the right parts to work with this.

Here is how I would use the pitch weights.


I have to find the right servos for the job for the pitch weights. Balancing this thing out will be the hardest part.

Some images of what it might look like. Taking from
http://www.airdroneinc.com/
and
http://www.airdroneinc.com/about_history.htm

(My favorite but I will not use it like this.)

 

[reactor1967]

make two sets of servos on the same rod. lube half the shaft and then put a free hanging weight on it. do it on the other side, now you should have sorta something like a gyro.

now, put actual rc servo motors on the same rod. make sure they are glued on with epoxy. now put free hanging weights on the servo. the free hanging weights in your diagram look perfect.

you could also think of mini thusters. maybe a couple of 120mm fans in a duct on each side. that one would be tougher to work out though.

Thanks Ruthless. After looking at those pics I seem to remember talking about this before somewhere. I don,t think I had it worked at as well back then.

 

[ruthless]

i had another cool idea for steering this thing, and i think its pretty darned cool. put a monorail inside the frame. then, put a weight that rolls along the monorail and attach a motor to it. you could even do two weights and a complex cpu to control it to make it do some pretty darned cool stuff.

 

[reactor1967]

i had another cool idea for steering this thing, and i think its pretty darned cool. put a monorail inside the frame. then, put a weight that rolls along the monorail and attach a motor to it. you could even do two weights and a complex cpu to control it to make it do some pretty darned cool stuff.

I am more about functionalability right now than I am about cool. I do plan the cpu and senors later on to make it work on its own without a user controlling it but right now I want to just make it work. Now I am looking at my own controls to make it sort of like a UAV but I am limited by rules and regulations which I am required to follow. But, I could did look at mounting a bw night camera and using some analog to digital conversion to transmit the picture with a transmitter of my own design with the video encrypted of course then un-encrypted at the receiver before it runs to my laptop. Then have the controls encrypted to but if it got out of sync then nothing would work so it would need a reset system too. But no one would be ease dropping or taking it over. And I would like information such as altitude and speed and other indicators to make sense of something that is flying not on the ground. I also thought about building a recovery craft to go get it in case I lost it someplace I could not go on feet to pick it up. Now that we have the dreaming of out of the way one thing at a time. Some parts, balsa wood, electrical connectors, misc things such as charges ect... and then I will take it from there. I will need some little micro scales to weigh it at various points to get it balanced out. I will buy the store bought transmitters and receivers for now but afterward we will look at some of them upgrades you and I talked about. I will require at least a night vision camera at this point because I want low lighting conditions to see in. You never know when that storm might blow up. Well that is my post for tonight. I have to get up very early in the morning to catch a flight out of town. I am hoping to be back tomorrow night. Everyone take care.

 

[RainmanTime]

Interesting little project. You should learn a lot in carrying it out. Good luck with it...

I have to find the right servos for the job for the pitch weights. Balancing this thing out will be the hardest part.

Indeed, static balancing is going to be one of your bigger challenges. But I would submit to you that your biggest problem is going to be flight control (i.e. "dynamic balancing" if you will). A little something I know a thing or two about...

So the approach you are taking with your weights is a generalized control moment approach. You use them to "unbalance" the otherwise balanced mass in the direction you wish to tilt the ducted fan's lift vector. It could work fairly well in primarily hovering flight, but if you are going to do it by trial and error you are going to have some.... errr... "fun times" learning some lessons as you go. Remember the stuff I was showing you about "Degrees Of Freedom" (DOF) and how they are used to develop numerical simulations? Well, I would recommend that this would be an excellent opportunity for you to apply these techniques to develop a rudimentary 6DOF model of your proposed ducted fan and control moment approach... it might save you some hardware failures and their associated costs. Just a thought.

The more sophisticated implementation of the general control moment approach you have selected is something called a "Control Moment Gyroscope" and it is very effectively used for attitude control of spacecraft that are outside the earth's atmosphere. One reason that the control moment approach is not typically used in vehicles that operate within the atmosphere is because of the variability of aerodynamic forces with respect to airspeed.

This is why I say your approach could work well in primarily hovering flight. However, where you are going to have problems (with control response) is when the vehicle assumes any appreciable airspeed in any direction. As that airspeed builds, you will now have to deal with the aerodynamic forces generated over the body's outer mold line. And this is also the point where a "trial and error" approach is going to be very costly, if not devastating.

The problem is that the dynamic control response of your moving weights is going to have to be programmed with airspeed (acutally, with dynamic pressure which varies as the square of airspeed). This reflects upon the speed and gain of the servo control loops you select to move the weights around. Constant-speed with constant-gain servos will work well in the hovering flight, but they will fail to get the job done in forward flights at any appreciable airspeed. This is where a knowledge of aerodynamics and flight controls comes it very, very handy indeed!

Some things to think about...
RMT

 

[reactor1967]

Interesting little project. You should learn a lot in carrying it out. Good luck with it...


In reply to:
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I have to find the right servos for the job for the pitch weights. Balancing this thing out will be the hardest part.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



Indeed, static balancing is going to be one of your bigger challenges. But I would submit to you that your biggest problem is going to be flight control (i.e. "dynamic balancing" if you will). A little something I know a thing or two about...

So the approach you are taking with your weights is a generalized control moment approach. You use them to "unbalance" the otherwise balanced mass in the direction you wish to tilt the ducted fan's lift vector. It could work fairly well in primarily hovering flight, but if you are going to do it by trial and error you are going to have some.... errr... "fun times" learning some lessons as you go. Remember the stuff I was showing you about "Degrees Of Freedom" (DOF) and how they are used to develop numerical simulations? Well, I would recommend that this would be an excellent opportunity for you to apply these techniques to develop a rudimentary 6DOF model of your proposed ducted fan and control moment approach... it might save you some hardware failures and their associated costs. Just a thought.

The more sophisticated implementation of the general control moment approach you have selected is something called a "Control Moment Gyroscope" and it is very effectively used for attitude control of spacecraft that are outside the earth's atmosphere. One reason that the control moment approach is not typically used in vehicles that operate within the atmosphere is because of the variability of aerodynamic forces with respect to airspeed.

This is why I say your approach could work well in primarily hovering flight. However, where you are going to have problems (with control response) is when the vehicle assumes any appreciable airspeed in any direction. As that airspeed builds, you will now have to deal with the aerodynamic forces generated over the body's outer mold line. And this is also the point where a "trial and error" approach is going to be very costly, if not devastating.

The problem is that the dynamic control response of your moving weights is going to have to be programmed with airspeed (acutally, with dynamic pressure which varies as the square of airspeed). This reflects upon the speed and gain of the servo control loops you select to move the weights around. Constant-speed with constant-gain servos will work well in the hovering flight, but they will fail to get the job done in forward flights at any appreciable airspeed. This is where a knowledge of aerodynamics and flight controls comes it very, very handy indeed!

Some things to think about...
RMT

Thank you professor. I was hoping you would give your input. After reading your post I will consider the airodynamics and adjusting the weights according to the speed. I need to finalize my part list and start ordering. I am limited to line of site with this so I can,t expect to go too fast anyway. Thanks again.

 

[reactor1967]

Well to update I looked at the airodynamics as the professor suggested and I found I could build it like a airplane and still make it vtol craft.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hhgtMFX3ATo

But what I may do is build a round control surfaces on it (a wing that wraps around the craft.) to use the increased pressure for lift thus to keep it from nose diving as the speed increases. As the professor said I will have a good time with this.

Also, I looked into the issue of the craft engine causing it to fly sideways or spin and I found that EDF engines have a very high rpm and do not carry the craft away. For what reasons I don,t know I guess good design. So I am looking at using one of them. I have to make sure it has proper airflow in my design. I had the issue brought to me in another forum with the members asking if anyone has seen a edf jet flying sideways or spinning out of control. Nope I have never seen it. Does not mean it has not happen. So I will try and EDF and see what happens.

Well that is where I am at.

 

[reactor1967]

Being thinking about airodynamics. This is my newest solution.


Now understand this is if the craft is built correctly. This will fly with pitch weights to change the pitch of the EDF as it flys the craft. The amount of pressure on the front of the craft in relation to its speed and the weight of the the pitch weights is important because if the pressure is greater than the weights then the weights can no longer be used to control the craft. So, good weather and not exceeding the airodynamic limits of the craft is important to a stable crashless flight.

 

[reactor1967]

Here is my final design. I will use the round shape of the craft as a wing to control the airodynamics so it will be important for me to know where the horizon is in relation to the craft. I might add a wing mount specificly shaped to give the craft lift as it leans forward to fly. I am more interested in generating lift with the craft than anything else. Later if I want I can also mount wings on each side and use servos to raise for use or lower them to the sides like a bird so they will be out of the way. At this point I am trying not to get too complicated so hince the wing mounts or airodynamic shape one or both. I can use gravity and thrust power for a controlled desent so I am not too concerned about using a wing for that. Going down is easy it is staying up and flying fast that is the hard part.

Someone told me I need something else besides balsa wood so I will look into that too. My wife wants me to spread out the cost and buy one or two things here and there over time so this won,t go fast. I will start with the EDF and ESC then I will buy the battery (going to be expensive because I want the best), then the transmitter, then the receiver, then the camera and so on. When I have all the electronics I will measure everything and finsih up with the body which I will do all at once on that. I may use a lite metal and if needed have a machine shop finish the body up for me along with some moving parts like the arms going to the pitch weights. I may use fishing line weights for those and on the ballast weights to balance the craft out I will use simple sand bags fixed to the body. The wing skirt I will probably make myself out of balsa wood or some other type of material. So here is basicly what everything will look like. On a side note I do not consider this a private design. Anyone is welcome to copy me or to copy me and make their own adjustments. If you do more power to you and good luck.

 

[reactor1967]

parts list update

Here is my parts list.

What is different about this project is I am trying to build a drone that can hover and fly and be controlled from a monitor with a transmitter and do some kind of work what ever that work may be. I even thought about mounting a rc robotic arm on it. I can't find one so I probably would have to interface one that is hardwired. I am considering mounting two duct fans instead of one but I have to program a power curve in the transmitter and receiver so we will see. I will learn a lot yes but I would just rather have something I designed work I want to skip as much of the learning process as I can. But, we all still have to learn. This will have 4lbs maybe a little more of thrust. So far I am thinking I might be able to get this at about 2 pounds leaving two pounds or less to work with on the load. So if I plan to put much on here I had better put on another engine or two. I think I can get by with my selected servo but I can always upgrade and keep what I have for something else or sell it. This is where I am.


Transmitter and Receiver - HAS VIDEO OF HOW TO PROGRAM.
http://www.hobbypartz.com/exrc62tr.html

Product Description
Exceed RC is proud to introduce another enormous change for the RC industry—the most affordable full range 2.4GHz radio ever available in 6-channel. This new 2.4ghz system brings together the unbeatable control of spektrum technology with the simplest, easiest-to-use design available, letting anyone, from parkfliers to rc helicopter pilot to take advantage of this new technology for less. For a spektrum radio and a 2.4g receiver, this is the greatest value in RC, giving you the most freedom to fly in your hands for less than ever before!

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Servo - Will need 4 of them.
http://www.hobbypartz.com/7g-micro-rc-servo.html

Product Description

Specs
Type: Sub-Micro, High-Speed and High-Torque
Torque: 17.2 oz/in (1.17 kg. cm) @ 4.8V
Speed: .12 sec/60 deg @ 4.8V
Dimensions (WxLxH): (L x W x H): .90 x .45 x .94 in (23 x 12 24mm)
Weight: .26 oz (7.5 g)
Motor Type: Coreless
Connector Type: Universal
Application: Electric slow flyer to park flyer 3D airplanes, micro to mini electric helicopters and 1/18th scale onroad and offroad vehicles
Voltage: 4.8-5.3V DC
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ESC & Ducted fan package.
http://www.ductedfans.com/Raging_Storm_rc_jet_engine_Ducted_fans_com.html
Storm Combo Storm EDF unit with Castle Creations 125 ESC W/cooling Fan kit
$369.99
Storm 70 Dynamiclly Balanced 4880 TBA Rotor diameter 70 mm 68 mm Weight 228g TBA Max RPM 54000 TBA Typical Cell count Lipo up 4S TBA Thurst = 4.26lb TBA Watts = 1800 TBA Lipo = Lithium-polymer See batteries
Storm with the Ductedfans pro set items (Storm fan unit with the MBM thrust cone and Castle Phoenix 125 w/MBM Jet cooling fan it's what we use.
The Storm HW is a new fan to the market it sports a motor in rotor design with the Hot Wind of Hoffmans killer EDF out runner motor. Said to be ont of the best on the market today by top EDF Jet modelers
Storm 70 mm motor in rotor Hot Wind fan.
The Storm is a (rotating can type) fan unit. The unit was desinged for the new people that need speed and like the performance of the Beast and Wild Beast motors that Hoffman currantly offers. So if you are coming to play yu may get caught up in the Storm.
Also see the Mighty Might, Beast and the Wild Beast the other great Hoffman product.
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ESC
http://www.castlecreations.com/products/phoenix-125.html
The Phoenix-125 is the paramount controller for either competition f5B and F5D flying, or just high energy hotliner sport flying. With an amazing 160A LMR surge rating, it can handle any LMR type application o the market. Space can be critical in tight performance fuselages, and the Phoenix-125's compact 1.25 x 2.65 x 1" dimensions leave you plenty of room for such an incredibly capable speed controller.
Phoenix-125 ESC - Only $199.95
See the Phoenix User Guide (1mb PDF) for more details on programmable options.

All Castle Creations speed controls feature:
Battery Eliminator Circuit (BEC): eliminates receiver battery
Safe "Power On"
Microprocessor Controlled
Tough surface mount construction
Audible Arming Signal
Auto Motor cut-off with reset Low torque "Soft Start": protects gear boxes and belt drives from shock
Smooth reverse exponential throttle
Self-calibrating endpoints: maximizes usable stick travel
Auto shut-down when signal is lost
Simple setup: no complicated switches
or wiring

Specs Part # PHX-125 Price $199.95 Volts w/BEC 12.6 max Volts NO BEC 25.2 max Lipo Cells w/BEC 3S max Lipo Cells NO BEC 6S max NiCad or NiMh Cells w/BEC 12 max NiCad or NiMh Cells NO BEC 20 max Continuous 125 amps Surge 160 amps Switching Rate Programmable
(11, 22, or 41 khz) Resistance 0.0006 ohms Brake Programmable Reversible Yes - change any two wires Low Voltage
Cut-off Programmable Size 1.05 x 2.35 x 1" Weight
(w/wires) 3.2 oz (91g) Connector Type Universal
Design Note:
There are two main types of ESC, for brushed or brushless motors. You cannot use a brushed ESC with a brushless motor or vice versa. Think of the features you will need like a brake and soft start. You will need a brake if you are using a folding prop and a soft start if you are using a gearbox and an on/off switch for a throttle. These features can often be found on Radio Controlled Sailplanes. The most important thing to consider when choosing an ESC is matching the ESC to your motor. It is good to use an ESC rated at a higher amperage than you intend running your motor at as an insurance against over stressing your ESC causing failure and potential damage to your model. Often you will see a burst rating for an ESC, meaning you can run the ESC at a maximum Amperage for a limited time, and exceeding this limit is asking for trouble. Most sensible aeromodelers like to have an esc capable of 10 to 20% more Amps than they plan to use depending on its quality. You will need a meter to measure the Amps and Volts being generated by your power system to ensure you are not stressing the battery, ESC or motor.
What is a bec? Bec is an acronym for battery eliminating circuit. This device provides power for the servos in your model. Many ESC’s have a bec that can only handle a certain number of servos at a given voltage. The higher the voltage you use the less servos you can use. Using too many servos from the bec in your ESC will cause overheating and failure of the bec. This will be catastrophic if your bec fails in flight so how can you safely run more servos with your ESC? External bec’s, or Ubec’s use power from your flight battery pack and are a cheap way of safely using more servos than the bec in your ESC can handle. A receiver battery pack is another way of supplying reliable power to your servos without using the bec in your esc.
Cut off voltage
Set the cut off voltage on your ESC to 3 volts per cell to ensure you don’t over discharge and damage your lipo pack.
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Battery

http://www.rctoys.com/rc-toys-and-parts/TP-2250-4SP30/RC-PARTS-THUNDER-POWER-4-CELL-LITHIUM-BATTERIES.html

Thunder Power RC Pro Power 30C 2250mAh 14.8V 4 Cell LiPo 4s 2250 Lithium Polymer Battery FREE Ship SKU: TP-2250-4SP30
Product Description:
Thunder Power RC Pro Power 30C 2s2250 14.8v 4 cell lithium polymer battery, 4s1p, 2250 mAh ProPower LiPo series packs.
The small size of these Thunder Power RC Pro Power 30C lithium polymer batteries is perfect for use in park flyer EDF electric rc airplanes and 250 to 400-size electric rc helicopter models in need of maximum power and performance.
Thunder Power RC Pro Power 30C LiPoly Batteries Feature:
More power in a smaller size: Similar size and weight to most 20-25C continuous discharge rate capable lipo batteries and 5-15% lighter than most other 30C continuous discharge rate capable lipo batteries.
The latest Thunder Power Lipo technology: Upwards of 15-25% more power and 3-4 times more cycle life than eXtreme V2 series batteries
The perfect choice for extreme performance electric model rc aircraft applications including EDF and pylon racer rc airplanes and 3D rc helicopters
Specifications for Thunder Power RC TP-2250-4SP30 LiPo:
Voltage: 14.8V
Cells: 4-Cell
Capacity: 2250mAh
Max Continuous Discharge: 30C
Max Burst Discharge: 60C
Max Continuous Current: 68A
Max Burst Current: 135A
Weight: 235g
Dimensions: 33 x 34 x 104mm
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Camera (This is the drone flyer. So we have a camera system and fly inside in the aircondition.)
Several camera's to choose from.
http://www.brickhousesecurity.com/wireless-security-camera-system.html
http://www.brickhousesecurity.com/wireless-night-vision-camera-kit.html
http://www.brickhousesecurity.com/wireless-nightvision-ir-camera.html

 

[reactor1967]

Re: parts list update

Also I have been doing some reading. A good thing to do with something like this. If I finish building this before I fly my own I will buy a cheapo and learn to fly it first before I crash mine. It might save me some trouble and money. I will start low altitude and take it slow. Also, I looked more at control systems and looked at thrust vectoring. I found it very interesting. All I would have to do is slap on some more servos and control surfaces. I will hold off on that but it was interesting. If I did that here it would give me more options for flight control. Later on after getting my education would come the flight linux operating system and a very small motherboard and cpu, some sensors, interfacing, some programing, and now we have a drone robot. But, one thing at a time. I have not even start buying parts yet. After looking at what I had it kind of reminds me of a tie fighter off starwars because of the round body and the wing(s) I was planning to add. My wings would be on either side or be one wing going halfway around the body. I won,t be able to take it to the other side because it would create drag then. I have to have lift without creating drag. I am still thinking on it. Everyone have a good weekend.

 

[reactor1967]

How to add stealth

Now what if we want our drone flyer to be stealthy. Here is how. Well we might not cancle out radar just yet or make it invisible but if if flys at night it will be hard to spot. Problem is with duct fans they give off a whinning noise like two cats getting ready to mate. What do we do about this problem. Here is what we do.

'Do it yourself noise' it's really quite simple and inexpensive. Continuously record the noise from the device (microphone) , invert that noise 180 degrees (one transistor), amplify it (audio amplifier), and feed it to speaker(s) pointed at the noise source (anywhere between you and the source) at a speaker output level equal to the noise source and, BINGO, you have your silence.

On the power curve of the throttle for the engine we record the noise at different levels of throttle. Now, we invert that noise 180 degrees and amplify it feed it to some speakers or speaker and point it at the source. Now our drone flyer (if it can carry all that junk.) will be silent.

I would build my own sound system because I can do that at very low cost to myself but for those that do not have technical knowledge as I do here is a link for you.

http://www.aerosoundrc.com/products.htm

This is a sound system for RC products. You would still have to record your own sounds and invert them on your computer. And maybe you would still have a little noise but not as much as it would without it.

I looked for other solutions but did not find them. I did notice with altitude the noise went away but if your trying not to offend anyone flying low and at odd hours will do it. I would have to do the inversion on my computer and find a lite weight sound system for the flyer. Yep, it looks like I will be adding another engine or two if I want the extras. I will go ahead with one engine for now and build a second one and caniblize the first one when I am ready to upgrade.

The professor said I will have to program the weights with the speed. I can program the transmitter and receiver and tie the position of the weights into the throttle power curve. I am not so sure about the left and right turns though. I may be on my own on that but I will see. My receiver and transmitter will be programmable. On balancing it out I was going to put it on some scales but after thinking about it I will hang it up in the air and balance out the weight that way. After all it will fly that way too. So I will hang it up and balance one side of it then hang that side uip and balance out the other side. Then I will hang it up in the middle and see how well it does. Eventually after hours of work I hope to get somewhere.

 

[reactor1967]

Remember the stuff I was showing you about "Degrees Of Freedom" (DOF) and how they are used to develop numerical simulations? Well, I would recommend that this would be an excellent opportunity for you to apply these techniques to develop a rudimentary 6DOF model of your proposed ducted fan and control moment approach... it might save you some hardware failures and their associated costs. Just a thought.

Do you know of any software packages that every day people like myself could get his hands on for designing the airodynamic shape and testing it. What I have seen so far is software for creating aircraft for microsofts flight simulator and testing it in that. Im not sure how dependable that is. Anyway I thought I would pass this by you. I know your point was for me to do it by hand and learn which was not a bad suggestion at all.

 

[reactor1967]

I might have found something though the professors input would still be appreciated if he wants to give it. I found a gnu flight simulator package that has another package that gives the 6dof simulation that the professor talked about. Here is the link.

http://www.flightgear.org/features.html

http://www.jsbsim.org/ is the package written in what else but the programming language of my choice c++. It is for simulating 6Dof degrees of motion. It had a couple of other flight dynamic models. Anyway I will check these out. I am interested in a corkscrew type of shape with the drone flyer. The shape would spin around in the air to create degrees of lift or desent as the craft flew. Don,t know how much speed I would get out of it but it would be better than crashing. My other thought was just to find a shape that I liked and put wings on it. If I am not planning on getting any degree of speed just going short distances then of course I would pick a good round shape to fly with. That is my input for today.

 

[RainmanTime]

Reactor,

Do you know of any software packages that every day people like myself could get his hands on for designing the airodynamic shape and testing it.

The first thing you need to understand is the difference between aerodynamics and 6DOF simulation, as well as the relationships between the two. A 6DOF simulation is a total accounting of all forces and moments that act upon a body such that the body's motion state vector (accelerations, velocities, and positions) are changed. Aerodynamics is the study of and quantification of the forces on a body that arise due to fluid flowing over the body. So a 6DOF simulation of a flying vehicle would be of no use (you could not get answers out of it) unless you have an accurate aerodynamic model to input into the 6DOF. This aerodynamic model is made up of a full 6-dimensional set of aerodynamic coefficients...sometimes known by the alternate name of aerodynamic stability derivatives.

So in simpler terms: You need to know (or be able to predict) the aerodynamic forces and moments of a specific body design as it moves through the air before you can run a 6DOF simulation of that body and study it. Now, I do not have a lot of faith that your education is complete enough to be able to understand the details involved in all of the aerodynamic coefficients, most especially the stability derivatives. This subject is only begun to be taught in the junior year of a 4 year aerospace engineering degree. However, there are very advanced (and expen$ive!) computer codes that can be used to estimate SOME (but not all) of the necessary aerodynamic coefficients.

The package we use at Northop-Grumman is called CFD++. CFD = Computational Fluid Dynamics and the "++" is, yes, you guessed it, because it is an object-oriented SW package based on the C++ language. Here is a link:

http://www.metacomptech.com/cfd++/cfd++_overview.htm

Again, I caution you that this is quite expensive, but the more important caution is that this package is for someone who is expected to have at least a bachelor's degree maturity in understanding fluid dynamics, aerodynamics, and finite element modeling. I am quite sure you would not begin to know how to use this code, and beyond that even if you did use it to build a mesh grid model of your RC vehicle in it, you would not have an appreciation of the aerodynamic coefficients that it may spit out for you, nor how to use them to understand the dynamics of the vehicle you have modeled in the mesh grid.

But there you go...this is how we professionals do it. Typically, on a small vehicle development program, we would have two engineers dedicated ONLY to the development of these aerodynamic coefficients, two engineers dedicated to the structural design and construction of the vehicle, and two engineers doing the flight controls (i.e. building the 6DOF simulation, using the aerodynamics in this simulation, and designing the control means and control laws that would control the vehicle).

BTW, while CFD is good for giving rough estimates, and it is especially good for very low speed aerodynamic flows, as I indicated above CFD codes can only estimate a SUBSET of the total 6DOF aerodynamic coefficients. For instance, the one set of coefficients that computer codes have no ability to predict are what we call the "dynamic derivatives". These dynamic derivatives specify how the aerodynamic forces and moments change in the presence of dynamic vehicle motions (such as non-zero pitch, roll, and yaw rates, as well as varying linear accelerations and angle of attack from steady state flight).

RMT

 

[reactor1967]

Thanks for the info. Yes my education which is outdated only went up to calculas. I was curious as to what software you used. I will take a look at your link.