Chronovisor Posts

John Titor

February 19, 2001 7:25 pm
Post Count

Through trial and error, and although they are quite heavy, hot and capable of putting out a great deal of energy (300 – 500 megawatts), it’s discovered that these microsingularities can be electrified and captured. It is also interesting to note at this point that electrified singularities also have two event horizons. By spinning these various microsingularities, a localized Kerr field is created.

It looks like a prediction. Is it.))

If you can take that paragraph and find a way to make a dollar from it than more power to you.

((i would first like to state that i for one have never said you’re an idiot – i said you are aggravating. which is not really a personal problem w/yourself it is just how i perceive you to be. an adjective – not a noun.))

Point taken. I apologize.

((so that’s what this is all about? you come here & want us to “help” you by asking questions.. so you can figure out how -we- percieve things & why we think the way we do but you do not recipricate the efforts. you only discuss things that you care about or that -you- think are important or that -you- think you will “gain” something from. seems rather -one-sided- to me.))

I was hoping it wouldn’t be so confrontational. I don’t see how words can harm either one of us.

((so you return home w/a better understanding while we’re left here w/the same questions we had before? it doesn’t seem very beneficial to -us-..just to -you- (atleast from your statements)).

You must believe that we both have interesting things to say to each other. Isn’t that worth it all by itself?

((What state do you live in now in 2001?))
I am in Florida.

((Is John Titor your real name?))
Yes, John Titor is a real name.

((What do you look like? Post a picture of your self. ))

((What is your secret agenda?))
If I tell you, it would just be an agenda, which I’m sure, is much less interesting.

((Is this dialogue between people in these posts part of your secret agenda?))
If I had a secret agenda, talking to people would not be part of it.

((Does your younger self realize what you are?))

Yes, he is aware that I exist but he doesn’t know who I am.

((Are you married?))

No but I did have a chance to convince myself otherwise.

((What rank were you in the Army?))

It is the equivalent of Major.

((Where did you go to BCT?))

I wasn’t fortunate enough to go to basic. We were fighting a war at the time.

((What company were you with, and what year did you graduate from BCT?))

The organization of the fighting unit I was in fell under the militia. We fought against the organized army.

((You have any fears? If so, what are they?))

I fear people who want others to take action based on their own emotions and irrational fears.

((What are the rules for fraternizing with people who aren’t from your time; do you make friends easily here in 2001?))

Have common sense and get your job done. Yes, I have friends.

((What would the DOD do to you if they found you out?))

I’m sure I would end up in one of their nice little padded cells while they poked at my machine with a screwdriver. What do you think they would do?

((What would you do if someone attempted to investigate you? Hundreds of people go through these forums a day I’m sure. Some of which can be government. Aren’t you at all worried that it’s only a matter of time before you are found out?))

I don’t worry about that very much. No one believes me anyway. Right?

((And you said; “I very much want to discuss our cultures but please help me understand how you won’t be able to change something I tell you happened on my worldine.” ))

Suppose I told you the space shuttle would have a problem landing at Kennedy tomorrow because something goes wrong with the runway. If someone with the authority to do so hears that and makes the decision to land at Edwards…bingo, your future has changed from my past.

((I appreciate you answering these questions for me John, and thank you for calling me your friend.))

I’d really like to believe that

((I want you to understand something – since you’re using our discussions to make a determination of our thinking for when you go back.))

I am not qualified to judge you. I merely said it would be a subject of discussion when I return.

((However, rest assured, if I went to the security office and said, “I have access to a time traveler” I’d get laughed at. I’d have to get in touch with the “right people” to “report” the incident, and even then the skeptics would over rule the “believers”.))

If that were not the case, I would not be posting at all.

((The US government… Russian or any other, would be in the same boat. They would, if they could believe it, GRAB and hold time travelers – checking the veracity of their stories and preventing them from having any interaction with anyone.))

Yes, that’s what I think too. The irony is, I’m not sure the machine will really do anything for them and all I can give them is stock quotes and sports news. (Just a little humor.)

((So – John, my comments about being fraudulent – please don’t take them seriously and please do not think I have anything against you personally, nor wish to discredit you. I only want the honest truth.))

I don’t. Truth is something we all want. Like opportunity, its something you have to be ready for to recognize it.

((John, what would it take to get you to stick around after spring and leave during the next window of opportunity?))

My parents are much better at cards than I am. I fear they may not let me leave in such debt. If I had all the time I needed, I would spend much more time downloading and archiving.

((I fear that another month or 2 may not be enough time to get as much said and discussed as I would like to have.))

I will continue to answer the posts as long as I can.

((In your “world time” have things like “Saquatch” , “Loch Ness monster”, and other reported unusual animals been seen, or captured or explained away. ))

We have our swamp monsters too. In fact, I think it’s interesting that we all respond to the unknown the same way regardless of our cultural experiences.

((Is remote viewing used to gather military intelligence?))

I am only aware of it from this worldline. I don’t know otherwise.

((Are psychics still common? are they used by the government?))

Yes, psychics exist but I don’t have any knowledge of their use by the military.

((Is there a Police Dept as we know it. Have any of your top leaders or politicians been jailed or impeached?))

Yes, we have police but they are organized in smaller groups. Yes, we still have political and religious leaders who find it difficult to obey the law. I would submit to you that the law is only as good as the people’s willingness to apply it evenly and swiftly.

((John, any chance of getting a better set of photos with more of the manual?. ))

Yes, I am pondering posting more of the manual. I am also considering having my departure videotaped and yes, it will be free. My only concern is how it might affect the “me” on this worldline.

((John please respond to my question as to “the prediction” did I jump the Gun? (get ahead of myself).)

I’ll have to go back and take a second look. Post again and remind me.

((One final question? Is there a Global Superpower state and what nation is it.))

Being a superpower only makes you a target. There is an uneasy balance in the world now that everyone “probably” has nukes, chems or bios. We don’t just bomb people for the hell of it anymore. Military power is based on the number of autonomous fighting men who are actually willing to fight.

((I guess you are held accountable, in some way, for changes that occur in your time period..))

You’re pretty much correct about your statement but actually, nothing I do here will affect my home. I hold myself accountable for any damage I do.

((It seems to me that with the cities under such stresses, people would flock in large numbers to remote areas like Winnipeg (sorry guys) or some other region with plenty of clean water, air and soil. Why is this such a nelected fix? I would also imagine that the network of Intentional Communities (communes?) that took root over the years, would provide infrastructural support to a nation needing to find its “FOXFIRE” roots.))

In my opinion, people “now” take clean water, electricity and their feeling of safety for granted. If they leave the city in search of fresh water they first have to make the realization that fresh water is a problem. It’s much easier to demand someone else owes you fresh water than it is to leave the lifestyle that made it bad in the first place.

((If I was transposed to the 1920’s or 30’s, you would have a hard time keeping me off the streets, out of public places, shops, concert halls, etc. just trying to take it all in. Ditto with just about any other time and place.))

I agree with you. The first time I walked into a “superstore” I cried. I’d never seen so much excess in one place at one time.

((It is interesting to note that the photos posted on that other site were posted by an “anonomyous time traveler” some time back. It fits the exact description John has give us of his machine. Therefore, based on his discription alone, I would say he is the one that posted the pictures. If he didn’t post them, then he is using them for the basis of his story.))

Those are mine. They were posted by another person who I’m sure is reading this also and would be happy to confirm that.

((John – in looking closely at this device, I see there is a hand control unit – with some sort of screen on it. I assume this is the computer interface through which the device is programmed (or time settings are made). Is that an accurate assumption? What does the display show you (for instance, does it simply show things like time/date calculations, or radiation [probably wrong word] of the fields from the device?))

Yes, that is a remote unit. The unit itself gets hot and “unapproachable” during long travel and you’re usually subjected to about 2 G’s. It gets a little difficult to move around and the hand held unit sits next to you. The unit displays many things but time in transit, time to destination, VGL variance and unit temperature are the most common during travel.

((Also, there are 16 apparent buttons. I have to assume further that these are multifunction keys (that is you press one for an alt/control function and other buttons have names or labels and perhaps even numerical meanings). Is that also accurate?))

Yes, the menus are screen driven.

Lola Montez

February 19, 2001 7:21 pm
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To John,

I hope you will get to some of my previous questions, in the meantime I have more.

Why are orphans an issue? It seems war orphans would be pretty old by now.

What is your biggest or gravest environmental issue?

Does distillation remove radioactivity from water?

Do people still watch TV?

Are there any women on your travel team? What is the status of women in your time? (This may only be able to be answered by a woman)Do they hold office? Work outside the home? Get equal pay? Are they safe on the streets at night?
What do women wear for the most part?

Are the Amish alive and well?

What is the birth rate?

Is there an unusual rate of birth defects and if so what kind?

Maybe you should be taking back healthy sperm and eggs.

You said that your culture was centered around the Universities. Weren’t they wiped out in the war? They are in cities after all.

Do you use cell phones? Eat allot of red meat? Drive cars?
Are airlines in operation? Internationally?

Are people pressured (subtle or otherwise) to adhere to a Christian doctrine?

Do police make drug busts? Are there many jails? What kind of criminals are in them?

What kind of public punishment is there? Sounds like New England during religious persecution and intolerance.

Are there Wholistic healers? Herbal medicines? Alternative life styles?

Is there personal freedom?

Is there an IRS and a need to keep a lot of receipts and paperwork around to justify yourself?

Is the same type of currency used? Is ours today good in say 2010 or 2020?

Other than time travel how do most people get around the country? Do people tend to travel much?

Are people suspicious of strangers or all you one big happy family now?

How do most people die during the war? Radiation, starvation? bullet wounds?

I have more but I better quit to see if you will get to these and don’t forget my first posting, please.


Pamela Moore

February 19, 2001 6:10 pm
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Hi everybody. wow! this is a very interesting forum.
for any body wanting to see what a IBM 5100 portable computer looks like they can see one here:

you will have to type it in I guess direct links are not allowed. ((
I am hoping this shows up ok and does not offend the moderators.
It is on the other board but I was not sure if the link to the other board was still on here.

Anyway it looks like a very interesting piece of machinery.
It will give you a better idea on the machine John is talking about that he went back to 1975 to get. how big it is and what it looks like.


Nikki Colwill

February 19, 2001 4:57 pm
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I just gotta say this is some of the best reading entertainment I have had in a LONG time!!!

Simon Wiggins

February 19, 2001 3:32 pm
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>>The only problem is, now you have to trust the person who brings the information forward.

Why if I had a glove sir !!!
Of course you could trust Art to fess up if you were right!

You must be from a very dystopian future to be so cynical

Javier Cortez

February 19, 2001 3:25 pm
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I’m still waiting for you to respond to my questions TT_0. After all, I did put HJYABJ 100 at the end of my post.

-Javier C.

P.S. Now it’s no longer an excuse of not being able to log on. We await your respond.

Ernie Vega

February 19, 2001 2:45 pm
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Hi John:

Best I could find is from the Hebrew Ha-Satan, or “the Adversary.”

First, let’s examine what the Bible reveals about the origin of Satan and the demons.

EZEKIEL 28:12 “Son of man, take up a lamentation for the king of Tyre, and say to him, ‘Thus says the Lord GOD: “You were the seal of perfection, full of wisdom and perfect in beauty. 13 You were in Eden, the garden of God; every precious stone was your covering: The sardius, topaz, and diamond, beryl, onyx, and jasper, sapphire, turquoise, and emerald with gold. The workmanship of your timbrels and pipes was prepared for you on the day you were created. 14 You were the anointed cherub who covers; I established you; you were on the holy mountain of God; you walked back and forth in the midst of fiery stones. 15 You were perfect in your ways from the day you were created, till iniquity was found in you. 16 By the abundance of your trading [rekullatek] you became filled with violence within, and you sinned; therefore I cast you as a profane thing out of the mountain of God; and I destroyed you, O covering cherub, from the midst of the fiery stones. 17 Your heart was lifted up because of your beauty; you corrupted your wisdom for the sake of your splendor . . .” (NKJV)
REVELATION 12:3 And another sign appeared in heaven: behold, a great, fiery red dragon having seven heads and ten horns, and seven diadems on his heads. 4 His tail drew a third of the stars of heaven and threw them to the earth. . . . (NKJV)
LUKE 10:17 Then the seventy returned with joy, saying, “Lord, even the demons are subject to us in Your name.” 18 And He said to them, “I saw Satan fall like lightning from heaven.” (NKJV)
From the preceding Scriptures, we can learn several things about Satan and the fallen angels. In the beginning, this “anointed cherub” was created as a wise, beautiful, and powerful angel. He apparently was one of the two cherubs who cover the mercy seat (God’s throne) with their wings (see Heb. 8:5; 9:5, 23-24; Exo. 25:20; 37:9; I Kin. 6:19-28; 8:6-7; I Chr. 28:18; II Chr.3:10-13; 5:7-8). However, because of pride in his beauty, this cherub’s wisdom was corrupted.

Satan is symbolically called the “king of Tyre” (Eze. 28:12). The coastal city-state of Tyre was one of the world’s greatest traders during Israel’s monarch period. Isaiah calls Tyre “the bestower of crowns, whose merchants were princes, whose traders were the honored of the earth” (Isa. 23:8).

Although the Scriptures don’t define the trade Satan was engaged in, it clearly tells us that because of the abundance of his trade, he sinned. Possibly Satan implemented a system of competition rather than cooperation, which eventually filled him with violence, causing his iniquity.

The word rendered “trading” in the NKJV translation of Ezekiel 28:16 is a form of the Hebrew noun rekulla, which means “traffic” or “merchandise.” This particular form of rekulla is only found five times, all in Ezekiel (Eze. 26:12; 27:20, 23; 28:16, 18).

However, rekulla is derived from the root word rakal. It’s relevant to note that a closely-related derivative, rakil, means “slanderer.” It’s used in this context six times (Lev. 19:16; Jer. 6:28; 9:4; Eze. 22:9; Pro. 11:13; 20:19). The account of Satan in Ezekiel 28 could well involve aspects of both these meanings. In the New Testament, this fallen angel is often called the “devil,” or the diabolos in the Greek (Matt. 4:1, 5, 8, 11; 13:39; 25:41; Luke 4:2, 3, 6, 13; 8:12; John 8:44; 13:2; Acts 10:38; 13:10; Eph. 4:27; 6:11; I Tim. 3:6, 7; II Tim. 2:26; Heb. 2:14; Jam. 4:27; I Pet. 5:8; I John 3:8, 10; Jude 9; Rev. 2:10; 12:9, 12; 20:2, 10). Not coincidentally, the literal meaning of diabolos and its variations is “slanderer.”

It’s possible that through his “slander” and “gossip,” Satan turned one-third of the angelic host against God. We know that Satan tried this approach in the Garden of Eden, when he misrepresented God’s motives to Eve (Gen. 3:1-5). The angelic forces loyal to God eventually had to cast this “anointed cherub,” along with his allies, out of heaven. From that point forward he became known in Hebrew as Ha-Satan, or “the Adversary.”

There is more e-mail me if anyone wants the rest


John Titor

February 19, 2001 1:14 pm
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((I believe that faith AND good works will get one to God. There are other things, but they can arguably be included under the headings of ‘faith’ and ‘good works’.
I believe there is an organized force of evil that works against God’s plan for men’s souls. It’s all part of the plan. Your next question may be “Why do you believe that?” ))

Please don’t think me so cynical. I would never insult or degrade someone’s religious views. My next questions would be “what about knowledge?” I am a firm believer that faith (and good works) is not enough to get to God. There is a mystery we must solve first.

((I vaguely remember you mentioned being religious . . . am I remembering straight? (I’ll look over the past posts of course, but reiteration doesn’t hurt.) How would you answer your own questions?))

Yes, I believe in organized evil. It would sure be easier to carry out an “evil” plan if no one beloved you existed. Just curious, can anyone tell me what “Satan” really means?

Had to answer those quickly. I have nothing but open-mindedness for religious conversation and I look forward to more. I’ll get to the other questions soon.


Joe Norris

February 19, 2001 1:12 pm
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1: What happens to Bill Clinton between now and 2036

2: What happens to Bill Gates between now and 2036

I am sure these are both headline events that will be talked about for several years to come.

Randy Empey

February 19, 2001 1:00 pm
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John T —

I would like you to answer any of the questions which you feel you can answer. I would not ask were I not curious. You, of course, are allowed to censor yourself and direct the conversation by what you choose to respond to and say.

It may intrest you to read some of the other threads on this bbs, the ones about other topics, like religion . . . and post in them.

But I think I can provide a brief response to your questions to promote further conversation here.

I believe that faith AND good works will get one to God. There are other things, but they can arguably be included under the headings of ‘faith’ and ‘good works’.

I believe there is an organized force of evil that works against God’s plan for men’s souls. Its all part of the plan.

Your next question may be “Why do you believe that?” . . .

My answer is two part:

1. I was born into a family where such beliefs run strong. It feels right to believe what my loved ones believe.

2. My studies since my childhood have done nothing but confirm that such beliefs are at least well founded, if not indicated by the way I understand that ‘things’ work in this reality. By this I allude to many different avenues of the pursuit of knowledge. Recently, the most convincing has been things I’ve learned in my study of physics, of all things . . .

Some scientist say science has made them athiests . . . I say science, as I understand it, has had the opposite effect on many others.

I like to think, and the more I think, the more I become convinced that my beliefs are accurate enough for my purposes.

But, they are beliefs, and I could not prove them to you.

Another reason why I am stubborn in some of these beliefs, the religious ones and other parts of my philosophy is because it feels right — almost as if by intuition or subconscious communications from ‘the other side’.

I don’t think the possibility of TT disagrees in any way with any of the elements of my philosophy.

I think many reading this thread would like you to expound on the elements of your philosophy, John.

I vaguely remember you mentioned being religious . . . am I remembering straight? (I’ll look over the past posts of course, but reiteration doesn’t hurt.) How would you answer your own questions?

Could you talk a bit more on how the ‘many worlds’ view point introduced by the advent of the TT tech. developed in your society affects the religious views of both the masses and the thinkers?

I think that it works with the way I understand things — Falling under the ‘many flocks’ arguement, if nothing else.

You mention gathering written material here . . . so I assume you do a lot of reading — before this trip, in your spare time, did you read much fiction? If so, what genre? Any books from this century?

What brought you to this bbs in the first place?

And here is another character-o-meter question I’d like you to answer: Have you seen George Lucas’s Star Wars Trilogy (bonus points for any of the prequels or sequels)?

John Titor

February 19, 2001 11:03 am
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((1. You have claimed several times that you will not participate in assisting anyone to get out of ‘death by probability’. Yet any number of the things that you have said could have already caused an individual to do or not do something that will now result in them either dying, or escaping death an otherwise fated death.))

It would help if you could give an example. If you are referring to the conflict and war in your future, I’m not sure I’m specific enough to help any individuals avoid anything. Suggesting there is a war coming is a bit different than saying avoid Washington DC at 3:45 AM on March 12, 2015.

((There is no way for you to know if there is no future world leader reading this and believing.))

Are you sure about that? Besides, I think you can have just as much impact as any “future leader”.

((2. You claim that you have no interest in proving to us that you are a time-traveller. To hear you take such a stance is laughable. Look at what a show you have put on here. Instead you tell us that you only wish us to make us aware of time-travel as a possiblity (see #1 again), or that you only wish to observe us and speak of cultural and religious issues, something interesting to a historian.))

I submit there is no way for me to prove anything on the internet, therefore it makes no sense to desire it. What exactly do you think I could do to prove it to anyone? I am confused by your term “the show”. Do you feel my only goal here is to entertain?

((You came and posted on this site with one intention that was clear as of your first post: to make us believe that you are a time-traveller. You have continued this thread for that purpose alone, and I find everything you have done supports this.))

Again, I am unable to make you do anything nor would I want that.

((As far as wishing to speak of issues regarding our humanity, or culture, it is quite clear that this is not your intention (contrary to what you insist). If you truly wished to do this your first line would not have been, ‘I am a time-traveller’. If you truly wished to do this you would not have continued this thread once you realized that line would not serve your claimed goals.))

I learn a great deal about your culture from the words you write (like right now). What do you think my goals are?

((The entirety of this thread has been: you developing your story.))

I’m not sure I understand this. How would “my story” differ it was “developed”?

((I find it very difficult to belive that a software tweak (hence ‘software engineers’, -software-) done to a 1975 machine could cause it to do this translation more effectively or more portably than something around even today.))

Ahhh…something we have in common. Yes, I felt that way too. However, my job was to go and get it and not debate why they wanted it. I am not a computer expert.

((I find it almost impossible to believe that a tweak done by a ‘software engineer’ in 1975 could provide for you something that you could find at no other place between now and ‘your time’, and certainly without having to make a stop-over in our time to get back that far.))

A great deal of the computer infrastructure you depend on is based on very old systems and code. One of the reasons I was sent to 1975 was because of the person I met there, not the technology.

((Furthermore, I find the notion that one of a limited number of time-machines would be used in this manner to be nothing short of nonsensical. There are more effective ways to accomplish what you claim in this regard.))

Perhaps you would share them with me. You might be right and I could make your suggestions when I return.

((4. I have, and continue to believe Dr. Hawking’s view in regards to the possibility of time travel if indeed the model of time is what you have suggested, that all possibilities occur in different time-lines, in different universes is the way that time truly is. For this reason alone I cannot accept you. It is entirely logical, and I have seen no good case to counter it.))

I’m not sure I understand what you mean. If you believe in Multiple World Theory, Hawking was not the one who first thought of that. If you do, then I must be real if all possibilities exist. As I recall, Hawking felt that it was possible to build a machine but some sort of vacuum fluctuations would destroy it right before you tried to use it.

((You claim that you have no desire to prove your story to us, yet everything you have done from the moment you first posted here has flown in the face of that.))

I’m not sure that’s true. In fact, I’ve tried to point out on at least two occasions that anything I do (at the request of someone else) to support my claims can be found someplace else on your worldline right now.

((What is more, you bring with you the claim that you will tell us no names, no locations, or any specifics as a result of your supposed ethics. If those were indeed the ethics you were committed to and reasoned with, you would not be here now.))

I am curious about this also. Do you think I should not interact with you for your safety or mine?

((I visit with a pink unicorn in the garden behind my house at night and it talks to me. I would show it to you but it only comes out when I am alone.))

For some reason, I believe you.

((Time travel may be possible, but if you were to time travel, you would NOT land on Earth. You would land in a vacuum of space. You have to take into account that the universe is expanding, the Earth, the solar system and the galaxy are all moving. If you truely did travel back through time, you’d materialize in 1970 where the Earth WILL be in 2036, which is NOT Earth.. it’s space.))

Yes, this is a problem. It was solved by taking a “snapshot” of the local gravity around the unit before leaving a worldline and incorporating it into the sinusoid during travel. The short answer is, you “stick” to the earth but this is only a useful explanation to understand it and it’s not practical. Since the computer system is using a virtual reference, the calculations become flawed. Thus:

1. Based on the accuracy and timing of the “snapshots” the distortion units are limited to how long they can travel before becoming unstable.

2. We must leave and arrive in areas we have prior or future knowledge of in order to avoid massive objects (buildings, water, etc…)

3. The unit has a fail-safe system during travel that drops out in case of a unit shutdown or radical departure in gravity readings.

((Answer this factoid, John, and I will believe you until the ends of the Earth.))

Again, you should not offer this to anyone for any reason.

((If John wants a way to prove anything – which from his previous posts he has stated he DOESN’T WANT TO DO – then I am more than willing to look over his proofs. However – just because I were to look something over gives no more meaning to the rest of you than it would if one of you looked his stuff over, believed it then told ME.))


((How would someone that came here with no money all of the sudden have plenty of money now? You could have brought the lowest denomination coin of your time with a mint mark anywhere after 2001 and probably convinced almost all of us. At least some people. It would be hard to fake.))

The reason I don’t have 2036 money is because it takes up weight, space and can be faked and I can’t use it for anything. What type of expenses do you think a time traveler would have that I would need so much money for?

((1) Simply inscribe your knowledge of any large scale events (disasters, discoveries, etc etc) over the next six months (there should be at least one memorable example) into a text file.

(2) Encrypt said text file.

(3) Give text file to a custodian. I sure Art Bell would volunteer, he’s very interested in time travel.

(4) In six months time give Art the encryption key and he can reveal what you said.))

The only problem is, now you have to trust the person who brings the information forward.

I’m not sure you really wanted me to answer those questions. If you could be more specific I would enjoy the conversation. Do you believe that faith alone will get you to God? Do you believe in an organized force of evil that works against men’s souls?

13 coming…

Randy Empey

February 19, 2001 7:52 am
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Mr. Vega, I excuse you as you ask. Complete understanding between seperate entities in this world is likely an impossibility. I claim no such moderatorship — I was just attempting to appeal to everybodies sense of ‘proper actions during mutually-benificial social interactions’ (I hate it when I can’t find the right, single word to say what I want to say . . .) . . . attempting to phrase it in a way that hasn’t already been said here . . . obviously, at least in your case, it back fired. I still feel its a good sentiment.

“Effective meandering” appealed to me for exact reason which seems to make you feel it was a poor metaphor. It has the meaning I intend, as I know the language.


John T:

Since you are stockpiling examples of written word from this time, whether to bring back to the future or for sources in your own written endeavours, I suggest you make this a two way street — you take our words, so lets have some more of yours.

Do you remember any poetry or verse from after 2001 in your past?

Is there an active market on new books in your time, or has that infranstructure not rebuilt it self? Are most the books available old or new?

Out of curiosity, as a rough judge of character, have you read the works of J.R.R. Tolkien? And did you enjoy them.

Actually, this all boils down to the question the last few posters have been getting at — R U THERE?

All –

Even if John never posts again, this thread would still seem to be useful . . . there is enough conflict here to make it good drama.

I think time-travel is possible . . . others among us think its impossible . . . there are other threads where battles in this war are fought . . . but this particular theatre is far from over.

Emmett “Darby” Darbyshire

February 19, 2001 1:22 am
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Sometime earlier you wrote that there are no paradoxes in time tavel. I have a question regarding a paradox that I can’t seem to overcome. Maybe you can help.

People who posit theories of time travel generally write in terms of time travel in years. My problem deals with very short trips – the kind that early experimenters would most likely attempt (to avoid divergence problems if nothing else).

In this experiment the traveller only goes 30 seconds into the past to appear in his lab. It seems that 30 seconds before his experiment was to begin he saw himself apppear in the lab. There would now be two travellers and two time machines. It doesn’t appear that it ends that simply as the “second” time traveller says that he saw a duplicate self appear in the lab thirty seconds before he started the trip. It would appear that its a time loop and an infinite number of duplicates see a duplicate self appear in the lab thirty seconds prior to the start of the trip.

Your time machine weighs 500 lbs and an average man weighs about 180 lbs. So lets say that that the mass is about 700 lbs per traveller. What is the mass of the duplicates and where did the mass come from? What is the result of the duplicates arriving ~simultaneously at the ~same place and time? How long will it take for the loop to decay? Will it decay? Is it a loop? What happens if the experimenter, upon seeing his duplicate, decides not to continue the experiment?

Lola Montez

February 19, 2001 12:23 am
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To John Titor:
I have found this thread very interesting. How far from what size city is it the safest to be? You suggest bicycle. What about horseback? Should we be stockpiling guns? What kind of people will be the ones least trustworthy? Is the conflict racial in any way? Does the civil war start in such a way that with this foreknowledge those willing will have time to remove themselves to safer locations. Will you readily be able to identify the enemy. Does living near a river with a distillation unit take care of water problems? How are the five people within the 100 miles contacted? Do communications stay intact. I have 86 acres on a river in Central California about 125 miles north of LA. I have geese, turkeys, horses, chickens, milk cows, good pasture, a well run by electricity, and a garden. I also have two teenage sons who are gun nuts. Plenty of rifles, semi-automatic and otherwise. Any comment on our chances or suggestions? My oldest son, 19, is joining the army for 3 years. Will he be asked to kill his countrymen?
I look forward to hearing from you.

Javier Cortez

February 18, 2001 11:04 pm
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OK John, I know your playing this Machiavelli role again, of going silent and hiding. But just wanted to let you know, that when you do return, answer my questions first. I asked first. So don’t avoid answering my questions. Got that ?

-Javier C.

Ernie Vega

February 18, 2001 2:56 pm
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Hi all:
Randy, although I remain to be convinced as to the nature of John or his story. I have never said he was a fake or a fraud, or a liar, actually, I expressed frustration at the seemingly all important “is he or isn’t he” debate.

I propose that “what John is” is irrelevant to this conversation. What is relevant is the ideas, and very good technical information being discussed here. I can tell you that I’m sure that some of the posters know more about time travel and it’s why’s and why nots, than they did prior to coming here.

The real interesting conversation has been about the culture he describes, and the way they approach life.

My comment regarding story lines is accurate. It does not however, detract from any literary work. It also had no connection to John Titor, I was actually disagreeing with the previous poster that stated that the Farmer General metaphor somehow was indicative of deception on Johns part, or a weak link in his story. The Farmer General is nothing new. History is replete with Farmer Generals.

I was pointing out to him the “preponderance” of similarity that exists in the area of “plot development”. As an author you must have at times asked yourself if the scene you were creating did not sound too much like “this”, or “that”.

Anyway, I just wanted to clarify the point.

Oh one more thing.

You say
The mind is the ultimate vessel for any kind of exploration . . . lets please direct our miranderings a little more effectively even on this micro level, . . . if only to please my aesthetic sense!

Please excuse me if I misuderstood but neither I nor anyone else here is going direct their meanderings in any direction to please “your” sense of Aesthetics.
As soon as you become a moderator here you can dictate whatever you want. Remember that whatever you post will most likely get a response.

By the way “effective meandering” is a poor choice of metaphor, you see it’s a borderline oximoron.


[Edited by Ernie Vega on 02-18-2001 at 03:24 PM]

Randy Empey

February 18, 2001 11:36 am
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Mr. Vega and Mr. Hendrickson:

The wonderful ability for the human mind to group things by simularities, generalize, and vaguely remember stories heard in the past exists.

But it is not conclusive proof of the falsity of anybodies claims.

I, as an attempted-authorer (pretty simular to being an attempted-murderer), have ran into the ‘universal hero myth’ dillema face to face, in mental combat to the death . . . and have yet to arrise victorious . . . but it does not mean I have no good stories to tell, nor that they are unoriginal. And it certainly doesn’t mean that any story I may come up with is most definetly not true . . .

I am fairly certain that proving anything is impossible. (By this I mean proving ABSOLUTELY . . . within certain frameworks, like mathematics, things can be proven . . . but in general? I think not. In what we call ‘reality’? I also think not. Life would be too simple.)

If this is true, and I think it is, it also follows that it is impossilbe to disprove anything — although the two are often different problems.

So the ongoing ‘discussion’ about the veracity of this TT’s claims is largely in vain. Good works may yet come from it, but I am sure there are better ways to spend this thread. John has already suggested this, it seems to me, and I believe it is everybody’s best interest to recognize that we have never been in the realm of absolutes and that the main goal here is the intelligent exchange of ideas, observations, insights and ‘feelings’.

Just because a plot appears often in the worlds portrayed in science fiction doesn’t preclude them from being what you seem to consider science fact.

Spacecraft are a prime example of this.

Timecraft ARE ALSO!

The mind is the ultimate vessel for any kind of exploration . . . lets please direct our miranderings a little more effectively even on this micro level, . . . if only to please my aesthetic sense!

I’m sure we will all be a lot happier and the fruits will then be better.

Ernie Vega

February 18, 2001 11:06 am
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The recent film “Gladiator” featured Maximus a farmer general who defeated a “fictionalized” Commodus.

I guess if you asked Joseph Campbell there are only a few stories and all literature is the re-telling of the same few stories in different settings.

Boy saves girl
Boy saves the nation
Girl dies boy avenges
Boy gets girl usually another boy loses girl.
Underdog defeats the champ. David and Goliath, farmer general
Good boy goes bad
bad boy goes good
and a few more.
there are a few that’s all then we just enhance the content to fit our cultural needs.


Michael E. Hendrickson

February 18, 2001 8:03 am
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The falsity of your claims is revealed in your predicted scenario for our country in the years 2004-2012,i.e., a virtual collapse of our constitutional system into a waring
divide between the cities and the countrysides, with a farmer general leading the latter to victory in 2012, presumably, after a horrendous, internecine struggle. I believe in fact this describes a plot in one or more
science fiction novels written in the past 50 years.
This scenario could plausibly describe events which, perhaps,
might occur 100 years from now, or even much further in
the future, but most certainly not commencing a mere
three years from now. A breakdown of this magnitude would’ve
had to have been preceded by many more fracturing events other than Ruby Ridge, Waco,the Oaklahoma bombing,etc., over a much longer period of time in order to culminate in your predicted scenario.
Given what we know about our society today with its
very stable system of government(however else you may
wish to describe it), your prediction of its pending
disintegration, beginning in three short years, is utterly improbable, if not impossible. Hmm., I’m, trying to
think, was it Asimov or Kurt Vonnegut Jr. who originally authored this scenario? MH
P.S. The idea of a farmer general leaving his fields to
lead his country’s troops to victory is an old one going
back, at least, to Roman times. Lucius Quintus Cincinnatus,
I believe, was the gentleman’s name, from the 5th Century B.C. Roman Republic.

[Edited by Michael E. Hendrickson on 02-18-2001 at 08:28 AM]

Andrew Hubbard

February 17, 2001 8:40 pm
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1) would you be able to internationally travel by:
travelling to the year 2001, fly a plane to the desired destination, and then go to the future from there?

2)If each world line is seperate from the others, then wouldn’t the consequences of your actions now have no effect on your original worldline? If this is the case, why won’t you tell us things that will give us knowledge or let us avoid death? My only geuss is that you are not a time traveller, and don’t want to say anything that could make a gullable person do something stupid.

3) how can I leave a message for myself in the future if the things i do in this worldline do not effect the others?