"The future ain't what it used to be."

A new way to time travel!


Here's a new, spur-of-the-moment way to travel backwards or forwards in time! All you need are lasers and a supercomputer. You have this room, with microscopic lasers covering every inch of the room. Now, the lasers are connected to the computer. The computer analyzes what's in the room (by using the lasers to reflect off of everything, and survey every single electron or proton or whatever), and then stores the data in its memory banks. Now... say for simplicity's sake that there was just an electron moving in the room. The computer has its position and velocity stored. It then 'jumps' back a step, by simply Newtonian physics, to find where the electron was one microsecond ago. THen another... then another... You could potentially span years with the computer on this single electron. (In the full room case) the computer has 'gotten back' to 1800, say. (In its memory, of course.) It then projects all the simulated atoms and everything, into a hologram so that you can actually see the past! And the same thing could even be applied to the future, if you wanted too! Can you tell me your comments? I'm trying to build such an apparatus, at first it'll only span one foot. It's nifty!
What type of computer were you going to use to store such a vast amount of information? Also, what type of laser to scan and reconstruct matter? This is of great interest to me.

...~The Doctor~...
"There is no time to waste, only time to change"..."The sum of all knowledge is that you and your reality do not exist; only thought and imagination are real, and therefore...I am."~ Magi Systems Forums~
Well, at the moment I'm just designing the basic idea, calculating the formulas using MathCad and writing up the basic idea on Word. But to answer your questions, I should think that for a cubic foot of information, a PC (Pentium III with 500 mhz or better) computer wholly devoted to the task and with a lot of RAM could probably do it. You'd need to create a computer/laser interface, too. And the laser doesn't 'construct' matter, it just creates a hologram, from an inexpensive setup. I'm not sure what laser I should use... as I'm still in the theory stage. The thing that bothers me is Planck's uncertainty principle... could the laser be accurate enough to generate an approximate simulation? I think the HoloTime device (as I like to call it) could only 'go back' almost 50 years (at the maximum) because no system can be perfect... Errors would start slipping in, and the farther back you go the more errors would happen. What do you think?

<This message has been edited by ProgBoy1 (edited 08 October 2000).>
I think this has actually been thought of before. The major stepping stones are twofold:

1) handling the sheer amount of data. This is on the order of exa- or zettabytes -- that's 10^18 or 10^21 bytes - much much huger than the combined storage space of the entire world's computers put together. Processing such an enormous amount of data would take eons, if not longer.

2) the predictive apparatus. If the world were Newtonian, this would be easy. Backward extrapolation could work infinitely recursively. But the world is chaotic -- for example, weather can't even be accurately predicted two days in advance, likewise you couldn't extrapolate what it was like two days ago from data collected today. Quantum uncertainty also plays a role, given the chance nature of many subatomic events.

I see one other hurdle for your idea -- the lasers could only see the surfaces of the objects in the room (if you didn't want to destroy them), so you wouldn't have enough data to predict anything anyway.

But by all means, let's try to think up ways around this. Do you have any ideas? I'll keep thinking about it.
I know... I wish that dratted Einstein hadn't come along and destroyed the beautiful Newtonian physics...
But um... here's some solutions (pretty pitiful ones, but you try thinking of them): To your problem about the storage of data, you wouldn't need all the memory. See, say you have a row of electrons (the simulated one foot cube in which we are going to 'time-travel'. Here they are: E1, E2, E3. Right? The computer gets the location and velocity of E1, and stores it. Before it stores E2, it 'goes back' one microsecond for E1, and stores the answer in NewE1. It then, in the other space which you have set aside for the hologram, 'creates' that electron. It then erases E1, and then gets the location and velocity of E2, and so on... Do you think it would work?

As for your second problem, the laser hurdle, there are two solutions. The first is that there is no living matter in the one-foot space, and the laser actively destroys the material inside, while gathering data. The second possibility is that you could use some sort of X-ray, or gamma-ray, I don't precisely know. Help me out on this one!

I don't really see a way around the quantum uncertainty factor, but shouldn't the errors be less if you try to extrapolate backwards, instead of forwards?

Let me hear your thoughts on this one...
Chaos theory, might be able to shed some light on the Quantum Uncertianty principle, but the study of Chaos is a new field in mathamatica, not even fully developed, though some of the Best mathamaticians are working on it, it will probably be decades if not centuries before they shed any light on Quantum Uncertianty. Yet even if you could solve this problem, I don't know how much exactly you want to save in your computer, but I know that a human body would take 10^31 bytes of information for an example if you had 10 Gigabyte hard drive disks, that were say 10 cm thich, to store all this information you would need so many disks that stacked one on top of another, they would reach a third of the way to the centre of the galaxy, about 10,000 light years away, or about five years travel at warp 9 in the Enterprise (From Krauss' "The Physics of Star Trek" and this is just to record stationary data. Then to actually retrievie this information with a speed of 100 MB/s would take 20 trillion years, change this to even 100 GB/s (which is way beyond current capabilities) it would still take 20 billions years, more time than most of us have to wait around. Again, this is stationary data, if you go back in incriments of microseconds, to go back one second, it would take million times the storage space, and a million times as long to load. This still doesn't address Quantum uncertainty, or how to locate the electrons, which we can't locate the exact place with current technology, or the scanning devise with which to use. This is a Good Idea, but It will take probably over 500 years of research to obtain the necessary technology, and at the sub-atomic level, it doesn't matter if it is living or not, it is the same and the same problem. We might revisit this idea in half a millinium.
My brain is not cooperating with me on trying to solve this one. I ask it for solutions, it keeps spewing out more problems! It says: "What about free will? If an animal were in the room, would it be deterministic?" "What about interference from the heat from the walls and other sources of energy not measured by the lasers?" "What about the energy introduced into the system by the lasers?"

I'm beginning to think this isn't going to work - I mean, to store all the data from one box with, say, 10 electrons, it would take an absolute minimum of ten electrons to store the data about the box contents. So for a large system, like a room, it would take an equal number of particles to describe that system, at the absolute minimum -- in effect, exactly duplicating the room. And that's if you took an instant image, with no time delay from one side of the room to the other--- It's getting me down: I'm almost thinking that it's physically impossible, rather than just by today's technology. What a bummer.
If I build a working model of my parallel disc design you might be able to convert my device into a storage for your computer as well as a generator to power your lasers. For if the constricted magnetic field has an infinite flux density it may be able to absorb an infinite amount of oscillating inputs enabling infinite calculations and infinite storage space to boot. (I am not from a byiou or anything I just watched the movie 'The Water Boy' not to long ago hence the jive"to boot".)However I must add that the there probably is a maximum amount of information that can be proccessed per given second and that this is probably a finite value as is the velocity of light and absolute kelvin. So our infinite calculations will actually be maximum possible calculations which should not matter on account that the maximum number of calculations for a set of actions within a given area is no doubt equal to the amount of actions possible in a given time period in that given area. The maximum number of possible interactions is given by taking the number of quantums in a given area Q and multiplying that number consectutively in descending order from Q to 1 ar vice versa from 1 to Q. That is 1*2*3....Q or for the mathematicians among us !Q. To find total number of events that will accur in a given time add the number of time quantums per unit area in the same fassion until an equalibrium is established which is the first common multiple of the time quantums and space quantums then add the total number of these multiples contained to the given area and divide the total number of possible events into that number at an instant. An instant is a vibration in the space-time continuum that oscillates at a frequency of 10E-43 meters persecond. By the way I believe that a spacial quantum is equill to 10E-35 meters that is a plancs length and a time quantum is 10E-43. The numbers is compliments of Victor. I could very well be wrong though so don't quoate me. To find out when all the events that can happen will happen and begin to repeat one must find the least common denominator of the number of spacial quantums total possibility and the number of time quantums total possibility. By measuring the time from the beginning the scanning device is first turned on till this predetermined time will mark a revolution of time for that given region which is determined by the amount of space measured along with the number of closed event accuring added to the number of open events accuring within that region. This also provides a matrix to plott the ramdom accurances taking place within a given area and shows how long it will take for actions accuring within the perameters measured will recur..or reaccur. (I am not for sure which word should be used there.)

what do you thnk?
A magentic field travels outward and strikes every object and energy is transfered between the field and the electrons of every mass. Conscequentely electroweak force transfers energy from with in the atom to the orbiting electron shells as well. So energy from the nucleas is transfered to the electrn and that information is transfered to the field and the field returns to the iron magnet at its southern most pole and for the southern field at its northern most pole. If one takes this field and constricts it to the area I mentioned all the information that is contained on the field in the form of modulated waves is contained at an instant at a point. It provides its own containment one need not even calculate the trajectory of the particles. For the three dimensional actions are transered to a field which acts in only one dimension. This makes it much easier to reconstruct the path of the field. As a matter of fact I believe that in tokyo they have a room that does this with sound waves. It is called reverse sound I think. Well you can go into this room and speek a word and as soon as the sound of your voice hits the walls of the room sensors take that sound to a super computer that reconstructs the path of the sound waves and sends the sound wave back and the sound travels from the edge of the room inward along its path and ends up at you mountand what you here is what you said backwards. Anyhow one need not do this all one need do is take the field constrict it to the area mentioned store the field in a capaciter and generate a series of these at real time speed. Then retap that field hook it up to a magentic tv and one can retreave the actions acurring in the past. It would really be the same thing as a VCR only magnetic field itself to replace the film. Good luck. As for generating making calculations a computer will have to be disigned to respond to quantum polarities. The amount of storage space is equill to the amount of area over which the magnetic field is expanded. Find out what the range of a magnetic field is and use the probablility mathenmatics I gave you in the posting above to calculate how much information you can store. The purpose of constricting the field is to increase the speed at which one can retrieve information and the speed at which one can store information within the field. No is going to travel faster the light unless unless the field interacts with an inductive field of electrons possibly where the magnetic field collapses intantly around one electron. To confine the field to such a small area is to confine all the events in the range of the field to that area making it easy to pluck out gobs of dence information. To make this information more readable merely expand the field just like micro film. One puts lots of information on the small area of a micro film and when that information is needed one just needs put a light through the film and presto. The information is expanded to be read with ease. What do you think? I will let you know about the device after I have built it and have made sure that it is safe. I will do this under the supervision of a research foundation with trained professionals in the proper fields. One ultimately may need to use an extremely small magentic to produce the affect you want for a large magnet will produce to strong of a field and electrical current. You would be better using the bigger magnets to power an actuall time machine rather then just a hollogram. Of coarse my origanal intent with this device was not a time machine but a power source not even nessecarily a perpetual one. The generator I propose the size of a basketball will I believe produce more electrical energy then a convetional generator the size of the empire state building. Don't quote me on that for it is just a figure off the top of my head but in the future I do intent to make an actual comparison for business purposes of course.

The device is mentioned in the postings in my forum in detail. However there is much information that is not included and I would not suggest attempting to build the device yourself just yet for there are some safety conscerns that I have with the device until I sort them out and establish the stability of the device I would ask that no one attempt to build it unless you know what you are doing. And if you do attempt to please take the necessary safety measures like measuring for radiation such as microwave emisions which are created by causing an electron to take a curved as opposed to straight path. And I would suggest not allowing the coils fire past 160 degrees in which case I fear that the system may become unsafe.

Edwin Gary Schasteen
Heisenberg's Uncertainty Principle is only one of the hurdles that you must surpass. Physicists are trying to use this same idea for teleportation. For your idea to work, you'd have to:
1) Invent a teleportation device.
2) Take it one step further by bringing a temporal variable into the computer's calculations adding a dimension of complexity to the problem.

Chaos theory makes it almost impossible because the equations your computer uses to calculate velocities and positions completely break down before long requiring you to introduce chaos theory into the equations and even then it still may break down. If computers have problems doing calculations moving a simple object from one point in space to another (teleportation), how much harder will it be to do multiple calculations for different points in time? The fact it's a hologram won't make a difference because we're still talking information and the same quantity of information will still be required.
I heard that in order to teleport something you must first make a clone of the object at the final destination and then destroy the original. I don't know if this is true or not, but if it is, don't expect them to be telling you this, especially if you're the thing being teleported.
Dear Victor,
I was thinking that perhaps it would be easier to set up this device in a manner similar to a radio where sound, which is our information, is transmitted into electrical currents in the form of a modulated wave. The electrical current is turned back into sound. This proccess is done by the use of peizo crystals a semicoducting crystal that responds to pressure changes caused by sound waves. I believe information to be contained to a given space and by using containing this information by use of electromagentic photographic means transmiting this to a field of superluminosity one will be able to create reverse action of light in the same way one may create reverse action of sound. No calculations required the proccess itself is the actual cconfining of events to a field and transmiting those events to a new location like a radio.

Edwin Gary Schasteen
We wouldn't use peizo crystals of course that was just an analagy to show the semmetry in conscept design and principle. The actual device would work for the assumption that knowlege of an invironment is quantizable and that in a given volume there is a given amount of knowlege which is defined by the border of events and there shape. The quantity of a magnetic field over a given area is equal to the knolege in that area and a duplicate of the half of knowlege in that area that interacts within the electromagnetic spectrum which is about half the knowlege contained to the area. The other half interacts with gravitational forces and is out of quantum phase with the electromagnetic spectrum. To constrict the field to a smaller area is to constrict the knowlege of that area to a smaller area making that knowlege extractable by lesser energies and through smaller channels. It is like taking all the water in the ocean and compressing it to the size of a glass of water in chich case one may transfer this water to another cup through a straw with a diamter of 1\4 inch into another cup and then expand the waters again to fill the ocean. Please forgive the euphamism for water is far less permiable then a field. A field of energy may be compressed with greater ease then a mass.