The Relativity of our Perceptions of Time


Chrono Cadet
Has anyone read Julian Barbour's book 'The End Of Time', in which he seems to have grasped the "holy grail" of current physics and reconciled classical Newtonian physics with quantum mehanics. His "time packets" theory really brings to the forefront the role our perceptions of time play in truly understanding the workings of the universe. To my mind, this line of discovery would be the key to actually one day "folding" or "collapsing" the mechanisms of time, ie. time travel. I welcome any discussion and ideas! <font color="blue"> [/COLOR] <font color="blue"> [/COLOR]
Hi Persephone,

Holy Grail is RIGHT! Everyone is searching for the Golden Fleece. The theorists are like a pack of hounds following on estremely promising scent! But it is a particular scent. If they lose the trail nothing will come of the Great Chase for answers which are UBIQUITOUS! But the rules of the game have always been the same really, going right back to geometry and anchient astronomy!

Yea, that is the one aspect of Barbour's book that leaves me wanting. His all-encompassing theories concerning the nature of time as "time packets" (similar to the quantum theory of light/energy conceived of in discrete packets, ala Einstein), when trying to conceive of an applicable process /ttiforum/images/graemlins/tongue.gifare indeed ubiquitous. What purpose do they ultimately serve, accept to enrich the imaginations of interested parties, physicists and the like? But-I guess dreamers like Julian Barbour and maybe some such folks as Leonardo DaVinci, Jules Verne, Arthur C. Clark, George Orwell, Gene Rodenberry, Isaac Asimov, Isaac Newton, etc. etc. serve some purpose in soceity, in that they help form our future paths of evolution.

Who knows, since Barbour has chosen a path outside of mainstream academics (by making his living translating Russion scientific journals and other published works in Russian), stating that he chose to pursue his interests in physics independently so that he would not have the pressures to publish until he had something tangible and developed, his ideas may not be credible to those who might be in the position to discover an applicable, practical use.

Then again, I find his ideas intriguing and quite mature in their objectivity. Wether or not the world physics community thinks he has achieved some sort of milestone in the quest for the Grail, I do not know. Have you read his book?

I just browsed through the book at a cafe and book store ensemble doing the typical thing I really
shouldn't be doing! which is speed
reading through it and only picking out words that are eye catching. Bad habit, I know but usually
if explanations keep getting dragged out in a story and it doesn't have the answer I'm looking for I
usually loose interest! Not that it wasnt good, its just that I THINK HE IS LOOKING FOR THE
WRONG GRAIL! Not exactly what I had in mind. The GRAIL that I'm looking for is A BLACK

The genepool of all stars and stargates...


Yes, maybe ultimately Barbour is heading down the wrong path, in that he is merely searching for understanding of the nature of time and the universe in a conventional manner. I don't think he purports to be seeking the key to time travel. Then again, he sort lives in a state of timelessness, since he makes his home at College Farm in Oxfordshire, England which was "built at the end of the Commonwealth in 1659". Evidently it is an island of history among a modern community. He has stated that it has significantly affected the kind of scientist that he is.

To me, I find his backround and knowledge of the classics interesting.

But I enjoyed his ability to abstract his notions with a clarity,ie. by stepping outside of his own existence and making the hypothesis that time is an illusionary construct of man, derived from the way in which man's brain strings together memories. He steps outside of that construct and conceives time as distinct "nows" that are not linear, only our perception of them are linear. He uses the model of these discrete "nows" as pages from a book, all torn out and thrown into a bag in no particular order. From this he goes further, using reason and logic, to conceive of the shape of the universe as an infinite pyramid. The apex point delineating the "Big Bang", and the pages of the book of time expanding outward from that apex infinitely. By doing this, he is able to both describe a defined universe, that has a shape (incidently, he effects this shape by eliminating all the "nows" that are possible but not held to the known laws of physics) and are also infinite. I thought taht was so cool! An infinite shape!

As to the GRAIL you are looking for, (a hole with spiral recursive compresion while fractally imploding through space and time), this interests me as well.

Since I was in college (I was a painting student with broad interests) I have been intrigued and almost haunted by thinking about the spiral shape. Occasionally, I seem to have revelatory insights into what this shape could be seen as, mathematically or otherwise. And it did seem connected somehow to another fascination of mine since adolescence, time travel.

What exactly do you mean by "fractally imploding"? Fractals, fractals, fractals....what about a "Fractal Equilibrium"? I would think initially, one would have to "fractally implode" to initiate a worm hole, but then the trick would be to acquire a "fractal equilibrum" to ensure stability.

FRACTAL EQUILIBRIUM: Imagine a sine wave with infinite intricacy, which is governed physically by the laws of nature (fractals), yet, that old "Pattern in Chaos" (Scientific American 1985) would serve to regulate the wave. Sort of like the game theory simulations people have been doing on forest fires or earth quakes, found in the book "Ubiquitous" which just was issued.

I hope this explantion makes sense, I tend to understand things in visual images, and struggle to grasp the words...sort of like the struggle to grasp the grail, HA!

stargate stargate my kingdom for a stargate........


I like visual images as well! Here are some from me to you...

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