"The future ain't what it used to be."

Was this experience timetravel,dimension travel or something totally different?


I knew of this person who had told me of their experience they had and I never knew quite what to think of it. I'd like to have your opinions:

This person said they went to bed one night, nothing unusual-but during sleep and waking up something happened. They said they knew they were awake but could not open their eyes or move at all. They said their brain felt tingly all over almiost like being electricuted but it was not painful. and they felt like they were being pulled by some force. then black. nothing.and then all of a sudden they found themselves in the air being pulled toward a ship on the water,some lake or ocean it happened so fast they were not sure. they said the water was blue. sky was blue and clear. this person was being pulled right to the deck of the ship and before hitting the deck they blacked out.
the next thing they know they woke up inside the ship on a bed. they went outside of the room and out on to the deck walking along the side and past the control room when this person was spotted someone pulled out a gun and pressed it really hard into thier left side. and they said they remember the pain in the dream.then they blacked out again and woke up on a operating table they said they could not see very well and did not have their glasses on at first the pain was excrutiating and then apon fully waking up it felt only like pressure like someone was pushing tubes in their side. and it was the exact same place as the gun was.they also stated that they felt drugged or slushy.and moved their hand slowly trying to push the other peoples hands away from them. then it happened again they blacked out and next thing they know they woke up in thier room on their bed. sitting up saying" man! what a nightmare!" but then the person relized they were extremely dizzy and lightheaded and had to lay back down for a couple of minutes.
my question is what do you think this person experienced just a bad nightmare or something more. they said the experienced seemed so real they actually checked their side apon awaking to make sure it was ok.
I have heard of such experiences. Although there are many theries and many ideas as to whether or not these events the persons involved were actually experiencing physical events or simply in an alpha dream stage is difficult to prove. But, if there is indeed physical evidence left behind as sometimes there is then it is at least possible that these events either physically transpired or that the spirit of the person involved may have been projected to another plane of conscienceness. I have had such experiences when I was in college waking up in a suspended state and being able to understand the algebra lesson of the previous day, or being able to hear others talking in the next room although my door was closed. I think that this phenomenon at least suggests that there is a higher state of thought and perhaps in a universe of time and space it may be an alternate reality.
What would have caused this to happen to this person? If they did go to an alternate reality what would have caused it ?after all they were only sleeping.
When you had these strange experiences,Keith what caused it for you?
I never knew what caused it. If I could have induced it I would have. It was just something that crept in like a drug or mind altering spell. I'm sure that a person more in tune with his spirital being as a Buddhist Priest at a temple who devotes himself to deep meditation might have a better grasp on alpha state dreaming and astro projection. Strangely a person from the west might think that one so devoted to Mind, Body, and Spirit loses much in his life. I would believe the priest however who says that on the conrary we have lost much with our fast lifestyles and westernized ways. Ask him and I'll bet he has time traveled through his Spirit. As for me or another who is not as in tune I would immagine was experiencing a rare involuntary instance that is a constant yet silent reminder that we are more than what we see.

<This message has been edited by Keith-Richard Burton (edited 05 November 1999).>
Very well stated Keith, what we call
dreams may be someone elses reality. Your
"time clones" we'll call them are spread
through an infinite number of dimensional
realities. All of the clones are mentally
linked by brain wave patent meshing. It
may be the case that when you dream that
you might enter the conscienceness of
your clones and share experiences.
Research on twins has shown to be
interesting in proving this type of


...The Doctor...

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...Magi Systems@ Ezboard.com...</A>

<This message has been edited by The Doctor (edited 09 November 1999).>
I have had an experience similar to the one presented by Pamela but to a lesser extend as I only blacked out once. I do not know what caused it. What Kieth said is true, and this is my point of view on the topic, that the soul can time travel if one is willing to devote their time to becoming more in tune and able to use it. If they can, then they will be able to control the travel. However, I do believe it is possible for the soul to embark on such journey on its own. If this is the case, I imagine that the indiviual might experience something like pamela's friend experienced (they would be just traveling from event to event without being in control or truely understanding what is going on.
That is just a thought and a possible explanation. I couldn't prove it to any skeptic. Nevertheless, I hope it helps.

To Eagle,
I'd really be interested in hearing about your experience in detail if you would like to share it.

Well, actually I went to counciling for a year after the experience because my parents thought I was crazy. Anyway, I have blocked most of the experience out so I really could not tell you much about it. I can say that it, for me, was not something I would care to relive. Sorry about that.


<This message has been edited by Eagle (edited 08 November 1999).>
That's Ok, Eagle and I do understand I really do. This wasnt the only time this happened to this person. It still happens to them every once and awhile. I think it happens to alot of people and they just regard it as a weird dream and move on. They keep it in the back of their mind and that's it. There are some things we just don't know about yet.
I believe that time travel is a broad statement indicative of multiple meanings. I have broken time travel into 4 types; time line ‘alteration or manipulation', the physical ‘real' time, an ‘imagined' time and an ‘altered state' time. In any of these aspects of time travel, we experience the sequencing of time.

In essence, we are a temporal being, a time traveler.

The physical ‘real' time travel
If we visualize time as a large tree (there are as many ways to visualize), the trunk and main branch is the physical ‘real' time that we all perceive and manipulate and experience events (ie. travel) on a moment to moment basis.

The ‘imagined' time travel
The branches represent the ‘imagined' time lines that we lament for, wish for, or ask the proverbial question "what if..." during our lives. We travel these imagined time lines and process sequences of events and consequences on the minor branches - are these real - yes, the can be. By following the branches in part or to their fruition, they can modify the real time line by implementation of these imagined time events. This is growth, expansion and exploration that make possible some of the great changes we experience on the ‘real' time line.

The ‘altered state' time travel
Other than ‘time line manipulation, this is the most interesting method of time travel to me. Have you ever wondered about the out-of-body experiences , the lucid dream (on controlled by the dreamer within the dream), the dream/vision quest or deja vu that people experience, perceive and vocalize? You may even be able to through alien abduction into that pot as well. As an American Indian (even though you don't have to be one), I put a lot of emphasis on this arena. I believe that movement through time, along time lines, manipulation of time and events can occur within and experiencing the ‘altered state' time travel. There is too much history, current events, scientific studies, "black" (or dark) studies performed to minimize the importance of this type of time travel. Singularly and collectively, the human mind is extremely powerful. It may be more important to learn how to manipulate, control and focus a collective thought process to allow for time travel in a ‘projection' type of movement than the actual physical.

The speed of thought and sequencing in brain is in the in the neighborhood of 50 microseconds to 50 milliseconds for neural transmission to occur. The fastest recorded transmission was .2 microseconds during an experiment in 1980 at the John Curtis School of Medical Research. Given the length of the cells used in the study (.37mm) the overall speed of transmission can be found as a function of r=d/t. This equates to 1.85 millimeters per microsecond. This extrapolates to about 4,000 miles per hour. As you can see, it doesn't begin to come close to approximating c. However, if you could amplify the strength of the signal and compress its frequency, the potential is there to have a very strong transmission and a very fast speed.

The ‘manipulated' time travel
This is were we actually try to manipulate time via some device and/or means to move into a different temporal space or dimension. This is the ‘time machine'. Read on the other discussion threads for more dialog and contemplation of such a device.
I'm almost inclined to agree with the Doctor that our dreams maybe linked to alternate timelines or even dimensions. It could be wishful thinking, but who didn't want to be what they dreamed. A hero. A savior. The conquerer. Our dreams sometimes affect how we react to situations or give us new insights, and leaps of faith. We are so much more than what we believe. Always have been and always will be.
The idea that people have "time clones" and are "linked" on an astral level doesn't sit well with me. If we are living in a multiverse where every possibility occurs in one universe or another, consider the narrow climitic range we live in. Only a miniscule amount (relatively) of the universes would have life on this planet (and for sanity's sake i will stick with this planet). Of that miniscule portion, a miniscule amount have us wonderful homo sapiens. Of those universes, an even infintesimally smaller portion would have one specific individual in them. The "time clone" theory suggests that life exists extra planarly accross all dimensions, which seems unlikely.
I know this isn't the same topic, but there is another point i would like to make. As far as the paradox; go back in time and kill your grandfather; i have three words for that: Cogito, ergo sum. I think, therefore I am. Obviously history would be altered, but as far as affecting you, you have taken yourself out of the loop, you have already been created, and are existing in the time line (past, future, present, doesn't matter). That in it self would be an interesting topic. Since matter can't be destroyed, what would happen to the atoms that are you? Ahh, well, enough musings.


You may not believe me when I say this. But I had the exact same dream. How long ago was this person's experience? Mine I think has been almost a year ago. Maybe less.

I recall the dream like this:

I was aboard a ship. Just how you described. Blue Sky, Clear Water. I was on the wooden deck of the ship and they were chairs with a group of people sitting in front of an audience almost. More like some important people who were funding the project.

I was apart of the group sitting in the chairs in a straight line in front of them. And in front of us all was a hypnotist, who was attempting to probe our minds for information. I started feeling dizzy, and just how you stated.

They were guards, blocking the exits and making sure we stay in our seats. But something happened. I realized I was military, and that I was being experimented on. Trying to control me cause I knew a lot of information about Time Travel and Dimensional Physics.

I reacted, and got the hypnotist as my hostage, and reached for a guard and grabbed his gun. I then with the rest of the group decided to fight back, and kill the ones that were doing this to us. All this time I was shooting them, I felt dizzy like if I was hypnotized. But I knew what I should do...

I took control of the ship, and asked for answers. But then I woke up, and recorded it in my tape journal before I would forget it.

It's been such a long time, and I didn't index my tapes back then. So I can't really go into exact detail about this pirticular dream (I've had so many to remember them all). But it's a lot like the one the person you knew experienced. It's weird that 2 people can have the same dream. It's only happened to me twice before, and even that's weird to this day.

Anyone want to comment on this, please do...

Javier C.
I cant say exact date though , I donno. also it was the front part of the ship and yes it had a wooden floor.
were the men with the large guns dressed in black? dont know what type of guns they were.large rifle black guns I think he said. they were standing by the sides of the ship where the railing was. the men that came out of the control room had smaller guns they were doing some type of experiment with the ship because it was well guarded. dont know what though.

i remember he said he was fighting them for a while and he said he threw something at one of them and was trying to get off of the ship it hit the other person in the knee and the man said "why you little son of a $&^%$%." thats when the people came out of the control room with a smaller gun and the man with the smaller gun said "that will be about enough of that." and stuck the gun hard in his side. there was alot of confusion and stuff ,people everywhere. but then he just blacked out and went to the next event. sorry i dont know anymore than that.
You said you were already on a ship but this person was sucked to a ship like a force was pulling him to it...right to the front of the ship on the deck but he blacked out before he actually hit the deck.
wow it would be strange if you both had the same dream. that is really interesting.
thanks for sharing that.

<This message has been edited by pamela (edited 23 April 2000).>
Man, this is just to weird. Yes, the guns were just as you described, big riffle type and the smaller guns the men in business suits had with them. And I was in the front of the ships deck. There was a lot of fighting going on. Did your friend perhaps know someone on the ship, or someone distinctive that caught his eye? I remember these people who might have been my friends. One lady, blonde hair blue eyes. And another male, I forget what he might have looked like. We were taking control of the ship, and shooting the guards with the guns. I believe their uniforms were black.

Man, this is just to weird. How could it be me and your friend have this similar experience? Were we perhaps at some level brought to this place unconsciously for some purpose? Some meeting place where we were to be controlled or thought something? How can could it be that in the future I cross paths with someone who has been apart of the same experience as I was? It's almost impossible...

There are still so many questions yet unanswered to this paradox. But I'm sure somebody out there knows why this happened and what it means.

Pamela, e-mail at [email protected]. I think we may need to talk more about this. This needs to be looked at more closely. Maybe there is something we are missing.

Javier C.