"The future ain't what it used to be."

Would Neo have broken the vase...

i think the point of that scene is to show that we have no free will. we live in a fatalist universe. she was supposed to say that and he was supposed to hit it. there is no option of not hitting it.

the more research i do into time travel...the more i realize how right fatalists are...which isn't a big deal. i don't believe in free will anyway.
Alot of people don't seem to understand that 'no free will' is not actually that much of a biggy. As long as you don't know the outcome, you will always have 'choice' in your decision. You're not forced to make these decisions, it's simply that you were always going to make them. Hence my sig. /ttiforum/images/graemlins/smile.gif

As for the Matrix, I like the arguement of Smith in Revolutions - why bake the cookies and put them on the table if the Oracle knew he would crash them across the room?

As for the Matrix, I like the arguement of Smith in Revolutions - why bake the cookies and put them on the table if the Oracle knew he would crash them across the room?

Oh, well that one is easy enough, at least in my opinion. Because even if you can't ever eat them, the smell of freshly baked cookies in the kitchen is reward enough in itself. It tickles the neurotransmitters of the mind in an oh so delightful way! /ttiforum/images/graemlins/yum.gif

Kind Regards,

PS - Now I probably have to bake some chocolate chip cookies this weekend!
It's a metaphor for God...

God knows everything that you're going to do right? But at the same time God says you have free will... but is it really free if God knows what the outcome will be?
The answer is yes and no. It all depends on your personal beliefs (for this example anyway).

If you believe in fate, then yes, he would have broken it anyway. To explain this answer will require a little more in depth explaination of fate.
Fate (explained pseudo-scientifically) is a series of chemical reactions. And they all started millions of years ago. Every chemical reaction leads to another and to another and to another. So what you do today is just a reaction a little farther down the line. You are going to do it no matter what.

I won't claim to know what you believe in if the answer is no. If the oracle had said nothing to him, then he wouldn't have moved, and therefore wouldn't have broken the vase.

But she DID say something. She saw it happen before it did. So the real question here is why did she say anything?
Neo broke the vase because the director wanted the vase broken we has doing what he was told.
Or did the director tell the oracle to say don't worry about the vase?
Or did a time traveler make a suggestion to the director 11 month before he made the movie?
wow, one of the first people to really understand a fatalist point of view. everything is reaction to something else...right down to the molecular level.

and i know no free will isn't a big deal. i believe john calvin said it was an illusion of free will.
The vase it self has purpose it was atoms of free will brought together by atoms of free will and reconstructed by atoms of free will.

The atoms it self run on free will.The fact it has a question added to it is the reason it is here.

The out come will be the same atoms of free will in the end. Will the atoms become questions of free will in the future? And what mite the answer be next time??

I hope time travel will answer the question i feel i know the answer to already!!

I think free will is a chemical reaction what do you think??

I think conciseness is the understanding of free will!!
Is the time i made the last post mean I'm in tune with the universe who else can do this as well?? 02/15/04 11:44 PM (
Or am i just a silly fool chasing my own behind?
And what does my questions have to do with the first question?
I believe whether the vase would have been broken or not can be answered by a complicated probablility equation, which of course takes into account the variables of 1. everything the oracle has every done in her life and 2. diddo for neo.

Doing the calculations on my vast array of quantum computers, I find that the vase probably would have broken either way.